Tuesday, August 30. 2011
In a time where religion is often portrayed as an enemy of truth, it is nice to be reminded that in Nazi Germany, it was not the newspapers or universities that had the courage to stand against Hitler. Instead, it was the Church. From Time magazine December 23, 1940, Albert Einstein speaks about the Church's resistance in Nazi Germany:
The Church today still stands for intellectual truth and moral freedom. Although the propaganda that surrounds us says otherwise. But it is the Church that speaks for the human embryo that is frozen, sold, discarded or torn apart for harvestable biological material. It is the Church that reminds us that we all began our lives as small as the period at the end of this sentence and our size does not diminish our worth. It is the Church that stands firm against the creation and manipulation of human life in the laboratory. It is the Church that speaks out against the seek-and-destroy mission going on in the womb against those that are not deemed "genetically fit." The truth is that when the Church stands for the embryo and fetus, it stands for the inherent dignity in every human life regardless of DNA or point of development.
The Nazi's dehumanized the Jews and other "undesirables" and the Church stood for them, however imperfectly. Now the Church is nearly alone in standing for the youngest and most voiceless members of our species. Those that many have gone to great lengths to insist are not human. We know better. I pray that those who despise the Church today will see in the future what the Church has done to protect the most vulnerable and innocent of lives and will praise it unreservedly as Einstein did.
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I have checked Time magazine and the quote is a fabrication. He never said it. (In fact, regarding the conference where he supposedly said it, a) he did not attend and b) he sent a note expressing his rejection of religion as the proper source of moral authority.)
I quoted the Time article exactly so if you have another reputable source I would like to see it.
I didn't write that Time didn't claim it. I wrote that Einstein didn't say it. That he didn't is strongly suggested by the quote itself. Einstein lived through the Nazi horror. He was a Left-socialist and would never have glorified the Nazi thugs' dictatorship as a "revolution." He would never have said the Catholic Church was the only force that resisted the Nazis -- a preposterous claim, since, while many Catholics were anti-Nazis of various political stripes, the Vatican itself forcefully backed the Nazis, including by having the Catholic Centre party (which had a strongly anti-Nazi wing) first vote for Hitler assuming dictatorial powers and then dissolve itself; by subsequently rescinding the ban on Catholics joining the Nazis; and by the militantly pro-Nazi Reichskonkordat, which ordered bishops to aggressively intervene to prevent any threat to Nazism, and which saved Hitler from total international isolation. At the same time, it was the U.S. Catholic church, acting under Vatican orders of course, which opposed the Jewish boycott of German goods, organized to protest Nazi actions in 1933. Einstein was not a fool and a toady, to praise a Catholic hierarchy whose leaders had ordered these criminal acts. Moreover the writing is totally unlike Einstein's; e.g., the writer is illogical, stating that he once had no interest in the church, but also that he once despised it. (Can't have it both ways.) This is hack propaganda writing, not at all like Einstein. But that aside, the Time article you quote, from Dec. 23, 1941, cites as its source for the Einstein quote an earlier issue, Sept. 23, 1941, and in that issue the only article involving Einstein reports that he refused to attend a conference uniting scientists with the Catholic and other churches, but rather sent a note stating that religious leaders should abandon belief in God. Here is Time, exactly as it appears:
""The more a man is imbued with the ordered regularity of all events, the firmer becomes his conviction that there is no room left by [its] side for causes of a different nature," wrote Physicist Albert Einstein addressing the gathering by proxy "To be sure, the doctrine of a personal god interfering with natural events could never be refuted ... by science for this doctrine can always take refuge in those domains in which scientific knowledge has not yet been able to set foot. ... In their struggle for the ethical good, teachers of religion must have the stature to give up the doctrine of a personal god—give up that source of fear and hope which in the past placed such vast power in the hands of priests. They will have to avail themselves of those forces which are capable of cultivating the Good, the True and the Beautiful in Humanity itself." "
You will find this in the religion section of Time, 9/23/41. Like all the quotes used by Pius XII apologists to portray famous Jews as having praised Pius and the Vatican as supposedly anti-Nazi, the Einstein quote that appeared in the Dec. 23, 1941 Time magazine (and is regularly posted on the Internet by Vatican apologists) is a fabrication. If you want a glimmer of the horror of your Church's role in the Holocaust, read the Encyclopedia of the Holocaust on Croatia.
What I am asking for is a link or evidence of a retraction by Time.
OK, let me try again. On December 23, 1940 (I mistakenly wrote 1941) Time published the quote, supposedly from Einstein, which you have posted. As its source it referenced Time magazine (i.e., itself) from September 23, meaning September 23, 1940. Thus the quote you attribute to Einstein, in the December 23 issue of Time, is preceded by and begins with the following text:
[Time excerpt starts here]
More than 80% of the prisoners in the concentration camps are not Jews but Christians, and the best tribute to the spirit of Germany's Christians comes from a Jew and agnostic (TIME, Sept. 23) — the world's most famous scientist, Albert Einstein. Says he:
"Being a lover of freedom, when the revolution came in Germany, (ETC.)"
[Time excerpt ends here]
So the September 23 (1940) issue of Time is the source given in the December 23, 1940 issue of Time, for the quote you have posted.
You can access old issues of Time magazine online only if you are a subscriber, or you can read them in any good US library, and you will find that NOWHERE in the September 23, 1940 issue of Time is there any reference to any statement by Einstein, praising the Catholic church. But there is an article in the religion section that talks about Einstein. It cites his message to a conference intended to unite priests and scientists, to which Einstein sent a message disavowing religion and calling on priests to abjure belief in God. Not exactly what you had in mind, I guess.
Conclusion: the quote is fictional. Only faith can sustain it. Facts won't do.
I got what you said the first time but here is the problem.
If Time did misquote Einstein, I am sure there is a retraction. I would like to see it. I am asking you if you have evidence of one. You instead keep giving me your idea of what you think Einstein would or would not have said based on statements in the Sept article about his views on religion.
If there is a retraction I would be happy to post it. In other words, I am asking you for "facts" that Time misquoted one of the most famous scientists of our time in their Dec. 1940 issue otherwise it is just "faith" in what you are telling me.
Dear Ms Taylor, I'm quite impressed by your skill in staying on track and being brief in sorting through Jared Israel's silly tangents and red herrings. If Einstein had ever retracted or been misquoted on this it surely would have been published, by Time or someone else. What a journalistic coup it would have been. That it never was refuted attests to its veracity. Keep up the good work. The world needs more women like you.
1. Not only was Albert Einstein’s speech reported in “The Times” (with no retraction by him in response - which would have been so “sensational” that no paper would fail to publish it) … but many other Jewish leaders were ALSO very vocal in their praise for Pope Pius XII’s efforts in rescuing the Jews and other minorities from the evil clutches of Hitler (whose BEHAVIOUR betrayed him as one of the most vicious of ANTI-Christs in history).
2. They attest that Hitler loved to LABEL himself as a loyal nationalist but instead Hitler was an opportunistic politician. Hitler was also known to be an zealous follower of ATHEIST Friedrich [“there is no God“] Nietzche (and despite Hitler’s cunningly-worded rhetoric in speeches peppered with “religious-sounding overtones“), he revealed his obvious obsession with “restoring” ancient Germanic mythical PAGAN gods back into German culture).
3. Victims of Hitler’s hatred attest that :
a) In the era leading up to Nazi Germany, Germany and the rest of Europe were characterized - not only by growing hatred towards Jews - but ALSO by growing hostility to Christianity.
In fact once children were conscripted into the Hitler Youth, they were taught that Christianity was a "stupid useless superstition", and that praying and going to church were a waste of time.
b) First hand experiences by victims told of how:
** already by March 1933 Dachau was established as the first Nazi Concentration Camp to where more than 2400 Catholic priests were transported for such “crimes against the state” as looking after the poor (eg the “Luebecke heroes” who were executed in front of their churches, and were made an example of, or for refusing to give the Hitler salute to Hermann Goring.
** by 1938 the Nazis targeted Christian churches even more violently and when the Nazis occupied Austria, monks and nuns were sent without delay to Hitler’s concentration camps.
Interesting to NOTE: If Hitler was so fond of Christians (as the “new atheists” would have us believe) then why did Hitler slaughter 7.5 MILLION Christians (alongside 6 MILLION Jews and millions of other minorities)???
c) It was Christians who risked their lives and own well-being to help Jews.
This was attested to by many Jewish leaders and historians, eg., Jewish historian, Max Isaac Dimont who said:
“ ‘If one believes the anti-Semitic, one should also believe the anti-Christian ... for both had a single purpose‘.
Hitler’s aim was to eradicate all religious organizations within the state and to foster a return to paganism” (, 1994, p. 397).
d) Contrary to popular belief propagated by enemies of the Church, Pope Pius was NOT silent and cannot be accused of inertia during the rising tide of fascism. In fact he was very vocal in his criticism. After assuming the Chair of Peter as Pius XII in 1939, his became the world's single most important moral voice speaking against Hitler and his murderous regime. October 11, 1930 articles in newspapers declare the Pope‘s opposition to Hitler‘s violation of human rights: "Belonging to the National Socialist Party of Hitler is IRReconcilable with the Catholic Conscience."
According to Jewish scholar and historian Jeno Levai, Secretary of State, Pacelli oversees "the dispatch of sixty notes in which the Vatican protested to Hitler against the persecution of the Jews up to the outbreak of war."
Pacelli does NOT trust Hitler, but still needs a legal basis (the Concordat) on which to protest against the extreme violations against Christians and the anti-Semitism of Nazism.
By 1934 Violations of the Concordat begin almost immediately after its signing, and the attempt to bring about the "virtual elimination of the Catholic Church" is clearly underway. Dr. Erich Klausener, leader of German Catholic Action is murdered. The harassment, arrest, and imprisonment of priests and active Catholics increases. The Nazis close some 200 Catholic publications in Germany, take over Church schools, and blackmail the young into joining "Hitler Youth."
1937 Cardinal Pacelli drafts the encyclical Mit brennender Sorge, issued in March by Pope Pius XI. It condemns Nazi racism and worship of the state in the Church's most authoritative form of teaching. It infuriates the Nazis, who respond with more persecution of Catholics.
In 1938, when Hitler is invited to Rome by Mussolini, Martin Bormann, a Hitler favourite and top Nazi, gives a speech: "We Germans are the first to be appointed by destiny to BREAK with Christianity. It will be an honor for us. A thousand ties link us to the Christian faith, [but]they will be broken at a single blow. Our intention is not to raze the cathedrals to the ground, but to fill them with a NEW ideology and with proclamations of a NEW faith."
1939 January 9, 1939. Cardinal Pacelli sends messages to the archbishops of the world asking them to try to persuade their governments to throw open their doors to the hundreds of thousands of Jews who are seeking to escape from German persecution. The next day he writes to American Cardinals asking them to intercede for exiled Jewish professors and scientists.
October 20. Pius XII issues his first encyclical, Summi Pontificatus, concerned with the "oneness of human beings". In paragraph 48, dealing with the Church's openness to all, it describes St. Paul's vision of "the new man who is renewed unto knowledge, according to the image of Him that created him. Where there is NEITHER Gentile nor Jew." The Nazis are furious.
October 28. The New York Times sums it up in a headline, "Pope Condemns Dictators, Treaty Violators, Racism: Urges Restoring of Poland."
1940 January 23, New York Times headline reads: "Vatican Denounces Atrocities in Poland; Germans Called Even Worse Than Russians."
January 24. Manchester Guardian says "Tortured Poland has found a powerful advocate in Rome" and notes that the broadcasts of Vatican Radio warn "all who care for civilization that Europe is in mortal danger."
The Pope contacts the British, but they are not interested in talking with any Germans, even Hitler opponents.
Pius XII orders publication of a large volume (565 pages). The Persecution of the Catholic Church in the Third Reich, in London (by Burns and Oates). It is a translation from the German of eye-witness accounts of the merciless Nazi program to crush the Church. It contains pastoral letters by many German bishops, and also reveals close cooperation between Catholics and Jews. On March 11, 1940 Pius confronts Foreign Minister Ribbentrop, concerning Nazi crimes in Poland against Poles and Jews. This heated confrontation is reported in the New York Times of March 14, 1940 under the headline: "Pope Is Emphatic About Just Peace: Jews' Rights Defended"
To see the extensive record the tireless actions taken by Pope Pius XII, see:
e) The Jewish leaders were so impressed with Pope Pius XII that on October 10, 1958: Dr. Elio Toaff, the Chief Rabbi of Rome, declared: “The Jewish people will always remember what the Catholic Church did for them, on the orders of the Pope, at the time of the racial persecutions.” He added:
“Many priests were imprisoned and sacrificed their lives to help Jews.” (Le Monde, Oct. 10, 1958)
And “More than anyone else, we have had the opportunity to appreciate the great kindness, filled with compassion and magnanimity that the Pope displayed during the terrible years of persecution and terror”
f) “The delegates of the Congress of the Italian Jewish Communities... Feel that it is imperative to extend reverend homage to Your Holiness, and to express the most profound gratitude that animates all Jews for your fraternal humanity toward them during the years of persecution when their lives were endangered by Nazi-Fascist barbarism.”
- Message to Pius XII from the Italian Jewish Community (April 5, 1946)
g) The 1943-1944 American Jewish Yearbook reported that Pius XII “Took an unequivocal stand against the oppression of Jews throughout Europe.”
h) Following the war, the Jerusalem Post reported that: “Thousands of Jews in Italy owe their lives to Italian citizens and the and the Catholic Church.”
i) Pope Pius was credited with having been personally involved in rescuing at least 860,000 Jews as well as many many thousands of other persecuted peoples.
Despite deliberate hostile disinformation by badly-informed Christophobes, this was virtually a universal perception of Pius XII - with good reason for people devoted to integrity and truth.
What is still astonishing is that some people still express bewilderment that various atheist regimes have produced bloodbaths that no other influence in history has ever matched.
Richard Dawkins himself raises the question of how could an "absence of belief" possibly cause social harm?
Little does atheist Dawkins realize that his own deepest viewpoint (that “there is no such thing as “good’ or ’evil’…”) do provide a clue to the [Hitler’s] “final solution.”
The atheist killers regarded their cause as so grand and noble that nothing should be allowed to stand in its way. They viewed themselves as acting on behalf of inexorable and incontrovertible forces like science, reason, and progress.
They therefore regarded themselves as having FULL PERMISSION to “eliminate” all opposition and/or to rule with bloodthirsty brutality.
Their own concept of their new totalitarian fascist rule was fully conforming to physical force and killing of any opposition.
After all to achieve “the atheist utopia ”the end justifies the means”.
… Yet some Christophobes are still surprised?
“witness to history”
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